The problem begins with the first mow: I had read that I should let TTTF grow to at least ~4" for the first mow, and then take off about a third. For the half of my lawn that I did this with, it was a disaster. Two issues happened - one, my clippings didn't get bagged (the shoot was locked before I realized, and this area is a long strip so I wasn't expecting a lot of added weight), and the grass essentially flopped over.

This was bad information. New grass, including TTTF should be cut when it gets just over 2" and cut back to 2". This should continue for 3-4 mows before adjusting to your normal height of cut. See this article - bottom of page 2 and onto page 3.

Go ahead and drop more seed. Water it the same as you did before when you seeded. Try to cut the existing grass as low as possible to give the new seedlings a chance. Let the ground dry out before mowing.

Do not drop anymore fertilizer at the time of seeding.

 

The problem begins with the first mow: I had read that I should let TTTF grow to at least ~4" for the first mow, and then take off about a third. For the half of my lawn that I did this with, it was a disaster. Two issues happened - one, my clippings didn't get bagged (the shoot was locked before I realized, and this area is a long strip so I wasn't expecting a lot of added weight), and the grass essentially flopped over.

This was bad information. New grass, including TTTF should be cut when it gets just over 2" and cut back to 2". This should continue for 3-4 mows before adjusting to your normal height of cut. See this article - bottom of page 2 and onto page 3.

Go ahead and drop more seed. Water it the same as you did before when you seeded. Try to cut the existing grass as low as possible to give the new seedlings a chance. Let the ground dry out before mowing.

Do not drop anymore fertilizer at the time of seeding.

As soon as I realized what happened I mowed the other side to 2.25" and it looks ok, but it still seems a bit lanky and there are some areas that aren't standing back up where the mower wheels went over.. so I've been gently leaf blowing it to move it around so moisture doesn't get trapped..

So it looks like my Toro has 2.25" and 1.75 as HOC options on the mower ( https://www.toro.com/getpub/173988 ), would it be better to cut it a quarter inch too short or let it grow higher and cut back to 2.25"?

 

If it were my lawn, I'd cut it to 1.75". But either of those heights will be fine. A quarter inch one way or the other isn't going to make a difference.

What rate did you seed?

 

If it were my lawn, I'd cut it to 1.75". But either of those heights will be fine. A quarter inch one way or the other isn't going to make a difference.

What rate did you seed?

I seeded at 8 lbs / 1000 sq ft, which I think is on the high end of what I had seen.

So I went back and dropped some seed on the part that got destroyed, covered it in a light layer of dirt and peat moss and watered it in. This is what it looks like now:



Here's some close-ups of the areas where you can see what I'm guessing is "rot" ? Basically the grass just died out and turned brown and wispy.. this is after I have raked out dead stuff and put more seed down, etc:





I have one section of the yard that's the most shaded which I just mowed down to 1.75" - but it's flopping over hardcore still:





Am I doing something wrong? Any suggestions? I want to put more seed down here obviously since so much of the other part of it died back from the same issue the area in the front did, but I don't want to mess up what's already there as it's maturing...

 

Two thoughts..... how much starter fert did you apply, what are its numbers, and when? The third number (K) helps young grass. Maybe you don't have enough. The fact it came in good and kind of petered out makes me think it may need more "food". Read the lawn reno guide, iirc they talk about "spoon feeding" lower levels (eg. .5lb N) more often (every week or two).

Have you ever done a soil test? Could be a low nutrient.

 

Two thoughts..... how much starter fert did you apply, what are its numbers, and when? The third number (K) helps young grass. Maybe you don't have enough. The fact it came in good and kind of petered out makes me think it may need more "food". Read the lawn reno guide, iirc they talk about "spoon feeding" lower levels (eg. .5lb N) more often (every week or two).

Have you ever done a soil test? Could be a low nutrient.

How does K help young grass?

 

Might have been thinking of P;

"P for Phosphorus, stimulates roots and new plant development. Phosphorus is important to the root system and will help thicken up your yard. Phosphorus will stay in your soil for at least a year.

K for Potassium, promotes disease and drought tolerance. Potassium prepares your lawn for the heat of the summer as well. Potassium stays in the soil for several months."

 

Two thoughts..... how much starter fert did you apply, what are its numbers, and when? The third number (K) helps young grass. Maybe you don't have enough. The fact it came in good and kind of petered out makes me think it may need more "food". Read the lawn reno guide, iirc they talk about "spoon feeding" lower levels (eg. .5lb N) more often (every week or two).

Have you ever done a soil test? Could be a low nutrient.

I applied 3.2 lbs / 1000 sq ft of the starter fertilizer I got from a local shop which was 18-24-6. I had read somewhere that it's not a bad idea to add a little bit more about 2 weeks after germination, so I did a half application and watered that in before my first mow.

I haven't had a soil test, just ran out of time this year to get it to our extension office. I know from talking to a neighbor that our soil tends to be very clay and his yard reno needed some lime, so I did some of that prior to putting down the 6 yards of 75% compost/25% sand mix I got

 

I did a mow (HOC: 1.75") on the side of the yard that hasn't had really too many issues yet yesterday - but this is what's happening after each mow:









I went back out with the leaf blower after the mow to get it to stand back up - we got some rain yesterday and I went back out after the rain dried to leaf blow again to separate the blades and try to get it to stand back up.

For anyone who's had this happen, do you have to keep doing this until the grass matures? If so, how long? Anyone have any suggestions on what other steps I can take?

 

Dont mean to be rude, but are the mower blades on correctly?

Almost looks like the blade is on upside down and beating the grass down with the dull side.

 

Dont mean to be rude, but are the mower blades on correctly?

Almost looks like the blade is on upside down and beating the grass down with the dull side.

I think this is a good call out. Chances are, the blades are on correctly, but something is off. That grass does not look like it's 1.75".

 

Dont mean to be rude, but are the mower blades on correctly?

Almost looks like the blade is on upside down and beating the grass down with the dull side.

Haha well I mean I'm open to any possible issues, so I don't think it's rude!

It's actually a brand new mower off the show room floor (this is my first time owning a lawn mower, so), I wasn't told I needed to do anything with it. I just called the dealer to ask if I needed to adjust the blades or anything - he told me Toro sends them attached and ready to go, unless you want to adjust the blade height (which I haven't done or messed with).

I do have clippings and stuff in the bag after I run through it, but wherever the wheels are pushes it down, so I have been sort of running back over where the wheels were to get that part to stand up / get cut.

 

seems unlikely but I would flip it, check against manual or post pic.

normally a rotary mower has a bit of suction to stand the grass up and cut it, it should not be flattening the grass like your pics. To me it doesnt look overly handed on seeding, and over watering alone doesnt sound right. If you are mulching, does the super recycler have a side discharge, that should provide more suction than mulching.

in your pics you can see what appears to be the tips of the blades for a bunch of the grass, its not cutting them and they are longer than 1.75"

 

seems unlikely but I would flip it, check against manual or post pic.

normally a rotary mower has a bit of suction to stand the grass up and cut it, it should not be flattening the grass like your pics. To me it doesnt look overly handed on seeding, and over watering alone doesnt sound right. If you are mulching, does the super recycler have a side discharge, that should provide more suction than mulching.

in your pics you can see what appears to be the tips of the blades for a bunch of the grass, its not cutting them and they are longer than 1.75"

Alright, so since I realized I don't exactly know for sure what it should look like, I took it to Town & Country today. The blade was on right, and I got it sharpened (even though it was new, they said sometimes factory sharp isn't sharp enough for new grass blades?). Here's some pics:







I also went out and measured the grass, it is definitely higher in some areas (though it's been ~2 days since I mowed), it does look like some of the grass blades just have bends in them rather than clean cuts, the grass is definitely being trimmed in some areas.





The Super Recycler does have a side discharge, but won't that just result in clippings being left on the lawn? I thought it would make more sense to not add more weight/etc by leaving the clippings at this point?

 

Always shapen new blades. They are never that sharp.

Do yourself a favour and get an angle grinder and a 60 grit flap disk. Probably cost you $50 total. You can sharpen them anytime you want.

 

Always shapen new blades. They are never that sharp.

Do yourself a favour and get an angle grinder and a 60 grit flap disk. Probably cost you $50 total. You can sharpen them anytime you want.

That sounds like a good idea! I lucked out today that they were able to sharpen it, they said sometimes you have to drop off the mower for a week until they can get to it.. yikes. Better idea to hvae my own for sure

Another question: How should I approach the areas where I put more seed down? Both in terms of watering and mowing? I'm just lightly watering right now until I see the little seedlings, but I know that's not doing the roots of the surviving grass any favors. As for mowing, the surviving grass is probably around ~2.5" ( can see some of those areas in the pics below) - I'd expect it to be a lot taller by the time the seedlings are over 2" - I'm worried about damage if I run the mower over it too early?

I'm also still not sure if the grass just rotted from moisture or if there's some sort of real fungal/bug issue going on.. Does this look like anything familiar? I put down an application of DiseaseEx at the curative rate just to be safe.

 

good deal on blade, the sharpening will help, if thats all the grind they put on it I wouldnt doubt you had a dull blade.

some of the new growth playbook is case by case. If you have more good grass that needs a cut, compared to spots that need help, I would favor cutting over worrying about the spots that need seeding. I would be cutting personally.

Take care of the 80% and then worry about fixing the 20% once you are up and running.

 

How much shade do the areas get that are laying over?
The pics you have look like the areas are under tree cover.

That looks like TTTF when I seed it in the heavier shaded areas of my lawn. The north side of my house always sprouts thick, and then thins out as the fall progresses and the shade gets heavier. I just have to deal with a thinner lawn on that side of my house through the summer. It gets better than the pictures, but it stays a bit thin. The good news is that weeds don't invade too strongly, because of the shade.
Every time I overseed/rennovate, I get excited because it comes in so thick over there, then it does what your grass is doing.

 

good deal on blade, the sharpening will help, if thats all the grind they put on it I wouldnt doubt you had a dull blade.

some of the new growth playbook is case by case. If you have more good grass that needs a cut, compared to spots that need help, I would favor cutting over worrying about the spots that need seeding. I would be cutting personally.

Take care of the 80% and then worry about fixing the 20% once you are up and running.

I would say honestly looking up close it's about half and half (pictures attached below). It looks a bit more full than it really is when looking up close.. so I'm not sure if I should try to get a mow in too soon and risk damaging the new seedlings, or end up with a similar issue with the rest of what's alive if I let it grow too long?

Maybe if I mow a bit later than ideal, since I know now about the fungus / leaf blowing, I can salvage more than was before? I also feel like because of the amount of watering I'm having to do with the new seeds in the ground it's never really going to be 'dry' like you'd want for a mow?

How much shade do the areas get that are laying over?
The pics you have look like the areas are under tree cover.

That looks like TTTF when I seed it in the heavier shaded areas of my lawn. The north side of my house always sprouts thick, and then thins out as the fall progresses and the shade gets heavier. I just have to deal with a thinner lawn on that side of my house through the summer. It gets better than the pictures, but it stays a bit thin. The good news is that weeds don't invade too strongly, because of the shade.
Every time I overseed/rennovate, I get excited because it comes in so thick over there, then it does what your grass is doing.

Honestly, they get a pretty decent amount of sun. My street runs approximately East to West, so it gets morning sun, a bit less in the early afternoon due to all of the tall trees (when the pics below were taken), and then quite a bit in the afternoon. I'd say further away from the mailbox (my POV in the first two pics) is sunnier, with the other areas getting a bit more shade. The last pic is the shadiest area (which is where I put the TTTF shade blend from SuperSeedStore down), and it's greenier than the other areas.

Looking a bit more closely, it looks like that's actually the exact path of one of the lawnmower wheels took - so maybe that grass just didn't get dried out or leaf blown enough?







Most shade:

 

I know I am jumping into this late, and maybe didn't read all the replies, but have we ruled out Pythium?? I know it's late in season but the damage sure looks like it.

 

I know I am jumping into this late, and maybe didn't read all the replies, but have we ruled out Pythium?? I know it's late in season but the damage sure looks like it.

I haven't ruled it out, but looking at the description of the damage it does seem like it fits. With the added moisture in the yard after the mows and the blades not standing up, we did have a few warmer days (temps in the 80s, nights over 65).. so conditions would have been favorable?

I did put down some DiseaseEx at the curative rate and I got some Propiconazole (which I haven't put down yet - but was planning to with tonight's watering for the areas I overseeded again..), is there anything else I should be doing? I'm still having to do a lot of watering with the new seeds down, but I did read that both of those were safe for new seeds.

 

Dont mean to be rude, but are the mower blades on correctly?

Almost looks like the blade is on upside down and beating the grass down with the dull side.

My brother in law did this once and I usually mention it to him a few times a year :lol:

 

I know I am jumping into this late, and maybe didn't read all the replies, but have we ruled out Pythium?? I know it's late in season but the damage sure looks like it.

I haven't ruled it out, but looking at the description of the damage it does seem like it fits. With the added moisture in the yard after the mows and the blades not standing up, we did have a few warmer days (temps in the 80s, nights over 65).. so conditions would have been favorable?

I did put down some DiseaseEx at the curative rate and I got some Propiconazole (which I haven't put down yet - but was planning to with tonight's watering for the areas I overseeded again..), is there anything else I should be doing? I'm still having to do a lot of watering with the new seeds down, but I did read that both of those were safe for new seeds.

When did you put down the disease x? Propiconizole won't do anything for pythium. Disease x , subdue and azoxy for pythium.

 

I know I am jumping into this late, and maybe didn't read all the replies, but have we ruled out Pythium?? I know it's late in season but the damage sure looks like it.

I haven't ruled it out, but looking at the description of the damage it does seem like it fits. With the added moisture in the yard after the mows and the blades not standing up, we did have a few warmer days (temps in the 80s, nights over 65).. so conditions would have been favorable?

I did put down some DiseaseEx at the curative rate and I got some Propiconazole (which I haven't put down yet - but was planning to with tonight's watering for the areas I overseeded again..), is there anything else I should be doing? I'm still having to do a lot of watering with the new seeds down, but I did read that both of those were safe for new seeds.

When did you put down the disease x? Propiconizole won't do anything for pythium. Disease x , subdue and azoxy for pythium.

I put the DiseaseEx down a couple of days before I put down more seed/soil/peat moss. I had read that it was safe to do at seeding/germination, so hopefully that's true!

I went out this morning to look to see if we had any new germination (I don't see any yet - today is day 7, but we've had some pretty cold nights in the upper 40's.. so hoping it's just delayed) and noticed this - I couldn't tell if it's fungus or a spider web? The squirrels keep digging up little areas to look for/bury nuts and this was in there:



I am thinking maybe I should put down another application of DiseaseEx soon?

 

Finally on day 7-8 there's some germination in the area that got messed up.

I have been watering often obviously for germination, but I'm wondering when exactly it's okay to back off and let it dry out for mowing?

A lot of what remained before is starting to get pretty tall, so I'm wondering when exactly I should mow this since half the lawn is new seedlings, and half the lawn is older. I'm also wondering whether not I should do any application of Nitrogen (something like Simple Lawn Solutions High Nitrogen Lawn Food, 28-0-0) to give the new seedlings a boost in growth so that I can hopefully mow sooner?

The color definitely seems lighter / more yellow, but I don't know how much of that is dead grass from before. Some pics: