[cnet24]

I'd like to start treating my landscape beds myself- currently, I am dealing with some weed pressure, fast-growing ornamentals, and insect issues. What/when do you apply to control this? I'm looking for chemicals in line with what is used on the lawns, but safe for landscape beds.

Ex: Landscape pre-emergents (something better than Preen)
Insecticides/Fungicides safe for ornamentals
Post Emergent Herbicides (I'd assume glyphosate?)
PGR equivalent?

I've never done any research and a complete novice on this side of lawn care. Any plans are greatly appreciated!

 

[Ecks from Tex]

Pre-em - Snapshot granular
Fungicides - whatever you do on your lawn just different rates

Post-em - Dismiss. And Glyphosate if necessary. Do not apply foliar

 

[cnet24]

Thanks @Ecks from Tex . Do you know of a PGR equivalent?

 

[Ecks from Tex]

Thanks @Ecks from Tex . Do you know of a PGR equivalent?

For shrubs and ornamentals? I have been using Cutless .33G Landscape Growth Regulator but have been considering trying Atrimmec PGR because it's a foliar application which I prefer. Cutless seems to do very well on shrub regulation and will really cut down on your maintenance, but it's absorbed into the roots and I always have a hard time figuring out the application rate. Plus, I've been expiranmentint with PGR on roses because I really find that avoiding doing major pruning in June makes the plant healthier all summer. But in Feb they are trimmed basically to the hardwood. So with a foliage PGR I feel a little more in control of when growth regulation begins and how long it must last.

This is a work in progress and I'm still sort of in the research phase on Atrimmec.

 

[cnet24]

@Ecks from Tex I did an application of Atrimmec yesterday on some boxwoods and Holly. I applied at 2oz/gallon and essentially sprayed to make all leaves wet.

 

[Greendoc]

Thanks @Ecks from Tex . Do you know of a PGR equivalent?

For shrubs and ornamentals? I have been using Cutless .33G Landscape Growth Regulator but have been considering trying Atrimmec PGR because it's a foliar application which I prefer. Cutless seems to do very well on shrub regulation and will really cut down on your maintenance, but it's absorbed into the roots and I always have a hard time figuring out the application rate. Plus, I've been expiranmentint with PGR on roses because I really find that avoiding doing major pruning in June makes the plant healthier all summer. But in Feb they are trimmed basically to the hardwood. So with a foliage PGR I feel a little more in control of when growth regulation begins and how long it must last.

This is a work in progress and I'm still sort of in the research phase on Atrimmec.

Cutless acts by getting involved with Gibberelic Acid, much like how Trinexepac does in grass. Atrimmec controls growth by killing buds and stopping apical dominance. Hedges treated with Atrimmec act by first showing yellowed and killed shoots, then acting as if they were trimmed. Atrimmec affects plants as if they were constantly cut and trimmed. Cutless reduces length of shoots, but does not kill them. I would not apply Atrimmec to roses.

 

[Ecks from Tex]

Thanks @Ecks from Tex . Do you know of a PGR equivalent?

For shrubs and ornamentals? I have been using Cutless .33G Landscape Growth Regulator but have been considering trying Atrimmec PGR because it's a foliar application which I prefer. Cutless seems to do very well on shrub regulation and will really cut down on your maintenance, but it's absorbed into the roots and I always have a hard time figuring out the application rate. Plus, I've been expiranmentint with PGR on roses because I really find that avoiding doing major pruning in June makes the plant healthier all summer. But in Feb they are trimmed basically to the hardwood. So with a foliage PGR I feel a little more in control of when growth regulation begins and how long it must last.

This is a work in progress and I'm still sort of in the research phase on Atrimmec.

Cutless acts by getting involved with Gibberelic Acid, much like how Trinexepac does in grass. Atrimmec controls growth by killing buds and stopping apical dominance. Hedges treated with Atrimmec act by first showing yellowed and killed shoots, then acting as if they were trimmed. Atrimmec affects plants as if they were constantly cut and trimmed. Cutless reduces length of shoots, but does not kill them. I would not apply Atrimmec to roses.

Definitely not applying attrimmec to roses, seeing as from what I've read it is likely to discourage blooms entirely.

I've got about 5-6 different shrubs im interested in regulating. Been researching it heavily. I have a lot of asian jasmine groundcover, where the root systems are scattered and not easily located. For that, I need something with a foliar application, which is why I've been researching attrimmec.

All in all, I definitely prefer the Cutless (or PGRs with similar modes of action) because it is from the mode of PGR that is a gibberelic inhibitor/blocker. That mode of action may block shoots and upward growth, but it also encourages thicker growth, drought resistance, and disease resistance. I have two problems, though. First being that I need a PGR that can perform with foliar application, and cutless is only granular. I researched other SePro alternatives like topfloor, etc., but their labels just did not seem to match my application needs. My second problem is that I do not think Cutless will work well on my roses, but could be 100% wrong on that one.

The farther down the rabbit hole I go, I start running into greenhouse PGRs like B-Nine and A-Rest, which seem interesting for flower pots and possibly even my roses.

Not sure, I honestly started just writing a summary of it so I could get it all straight. Probably will post it on here so other's can benefit from it as well once I'm done.

 

[Ecks from Tex]

@Ecks from Tex I did an application of Atrimmec yesterday on some boxwoods and Holly. I applied at 2oz/gallon and essentially sprayed to make all leaves wet.

Interesting! Let me know how it goes. With the boxwoods, cutless is stellar. But attrimmec is 50% cheaper and could achieve a similar result on those hardwood shrubs, so let me know how it progresses. I've very interested in the first 2-3 weeks; maybe photos?

But like @Greendoc said, use caution with attrimec. It is a chemical pincher. Pinching is just the greenhouse term for pruning, which is traditionally done "mechanically" ie, by hand or with a tool. Attrimec does the exact same thing chemically.

 

[Darrell]

Fascinating.

Have you used PGRs on annuals or perennials? I love coleus. This time of year they are getting too tall and going to seed. Could you use a PGR when an annual achieves its desired height?

 

[Ecks from Tex]

Fascinating.

Have you used PGRs on annuals or perennials?

Perennials but PGRs actually were used early on for annuals and are widely used for annuals today. It's by far their most popular use.

I love coleus. This time of year they are getting too tall and going to seed. Could you use a PGR when an annual achieves its desired height?

Yes. Growers in Nurseries use PGR to regulate plant height and to delay flower blooms so that plants bought at the store don't bloom until the consumer gets them home. But you have to find the right PGR, which in that world is extremely complicated. I have been doing a write up on it for my own personal use but will probably post it once done for others. I am finally starting to understand how it all works together. What I have learned is that often the best result is achieved when you tank mix PGRs with different modes of action to achieve the perfect result you are looking for in the flower.

 

[Darrell]

I would be most interested in that write up. I've ordered annual seeds from growers in the past. Their instructions include how to apply PGR's for those growers who will be sending their plants to retailers. I knew that these big companies did it, but for some reason it never crossed my mind to consider using a PGR in my landscape.

There's certainly a lot to think about. For annuals such as Coleus I would simply want to limit apical growth. For perennials and roses I would not want to affect their flower production. I'm sure it's difficult to walk that fine line between limiting mature height without limiting flower production.

Great info, Ecks.

 

[Greendoc]

For limiting height and vigor, the PGRs that work by interacting with Gibberelic acid are the best. Cutless 0.3 G is one. Then there is A-Rest, Bonzi, Sumagic, and their off patent equivalents. Broadleaf plants are extremely responsive to these products. Measuring the right dosage might become interesting. They also work differently if applied to the soil. Leaves are not highly absorbent, but roots take up the product readily.

 

[Darrell]

Granular vs foliar application...

Wouldn't a foliar app give you more control over target height? How do you control final height with a root application? I'm sure I'm making a novice assumption that you apply a foliar application when your plant reaches target height and it magically stops growing. I bet it's not that easy, is it?

 

[Greendoc]

Not that easy at all. You have to also figure out how long it takes between time of application and when that growth control kicks in. What the greenhouse growers do is a real art. They try out dosages on a few flats before doing the entire crop. They have also been doing it long enough to know how weather, humidity, and light levels affects response to the products. Granular application with Cutless is actually pretty predictable. Cut plants back to desired height. Apply and it is good. Foliar application gets funny because not all plants respond to foliar application equally. You also do not want the spray drifting onto plants that are sensitive. A handful of the Cutless under unruly shrubs is pretty manageable. I will apply Atrrimec on a buckwild hedge with no other plants near by.

 

[Darrell]

Does Cutless inhibit/affect flower production?

 

[Greendoc]

No. It mostly affects height. Attrimec is actually used to stop unwanted flowering and fruiting in trees because of its ability to kill flower buds.

 

[Ecks from Tex]

For limiting height and vigor, the PGRs that work by interacting with Gibberelic acid are the best. Cutless 0.3 G is one. Then there is A-Rest, Bonzi, Sumagic, and their off patent equivalents. Broadleaf plants are extremely responsive to these products. Measuring the right dosage might become interesting. They also work differently if applied to the soil. Leaves are not highly absorbent, but roots take up the product readily.

Do you think I can regulate Asian Jasmin with Atrimmec?

I found this article discussing Cutless results in asiatic jasmine, but I truly don't understand how you get an effective application when you have the stuff as groundcover or growing on a fence somewhere. I have no idea where the root systems are or where they go.

On the other hand, this 1994 study found Atrimmec significantly reduced horizontal growth on asiatic jasmine.

Really not a lot of literature out there on how these growth regulators work in landscaping. Which is why I like Cutless so much.

 

[Ecks from Tex]

Granular vs foliar application...

Wouldn't a foliar app give you more control over target height? How do you control final height with a root application? I'm sure I'm making a novice assumption that you apply a foliar application when your plant reaches target height and it magically stops growing. I bet it's not that easy, is it?

Cutless granular is hands down the best option for anyone wanting to control basic woody ornamentals, even flowering ornamentals, who does not have experience in PGRs. I can attest the rest of the PGRs are pretty complicated and truly an art once you start using them off the lawn. You have to test on small samples first because you truly never know what the effects will be for most plants that are not specifically labeled.

 

[Greendoc]

For limiting height and vigor, the PGRs that work by interacting with Gibberelic acid are the best. Cutless 0.3 G is one. Then there is A-Rest, Bonzi, Sumagic, and their off patent equivalents. Broadleaf plants are extremely responsive to these products. Measuring the right dosage might become interesting. They also work differently if applied to the soil. Leaves are not highly absorbent, but roots take up the product readily.

Do you think I can regulate Asian Jasmin with Atrimmec?

I found this article discussing Cutless results in asiatic jasmine, but I truly don't understand how you get an effective application when you have the stuff as groundcover or growing on a fence somewhere. I have no idea where the root systems are or where they go.

On the other hand, this 1994 study found Atrimmec significantly reduced horizontal growth on asiatic jasmine.

Really not a lot of literature out there on how these growth regulators work in landscaping. Which is why I like Cutless so much.

Atrmmec will stop growth for sure. The way I use it is to cut back the unruly plant/hedge/shrub to desired size, then I spray. When the bud kill occurs, the plant is stopped at that height and size.

 

[Ecks from Tex]

For limiting height and vigor, the PGRs that work by interacting with Gibberelic acid are the best. Cutless 0.3 G is one. Then there is A-Rest, Bonzi, Sumagic, and their off patent equivalents. Broadleaf plants are extremely responsive to these products. Measuring the right dosage might become interesting. They also work differently if applied to the soil. Leaves are not highly absorbent, but roots take up the product readily.

Do you think I can regulate Asian Jasmin with Atrimmec?

I found this article discussing Cutless results in asiatic jasmine, but I truly don't understand how you get an effective application when you have the stuff as groundcover or growing on a fence somewhere. I have no idea where the root systems are or where they go.

On the other hand, this 1994 study found Atrimmec significantly reduced horizontal growth on asiatic jasmine.

Really not a lot of literature out there on how these growth regulators work in landscaping. Which is why I like Cutless so much.

Atrmmec will stop growth for sure. The way I use it is to cut back the unruly plant/hedge/shrub to desired size, then I spray. When the bud kill occurs, the plant is stopped at that height and size.

I'm going to get some and try it. I just want to regulate my groundcover so I don't have to trim it so often.

Looks like I will have Cutless for the beds, Atrimmec for the groundcover, and then something like Configure/A-Rest/Bonzi, Sumagic, B-Nine, etc. (GA Inhibitors) for any specialty flowering or plant applications.