[kur1j]

So late last year (really late) I hit the curb with my reel mower bedknife . It broke the bedknife and in the process jammed the reel and busted the reel. It was late in the season and I was basically done mowing for the year.

It's about time to start mowing again so I'm out here working on it to get it back together.

I've got the bearings replaced and put back in their housing and housings back on the reel (wasn't as bad as I thought it was going to be). The shaft in the bearing isn't super tight and it slipped on pretty easily. The question I have is that about the shaft of the reel spinning in the bearing instead of the bearing spinning on the shaft.

For reference part 39 is the bearing and rolls inside of part 40. Since the shaft is not super tight on the inside of the bearing (or doesn't seem to be) I'm worried that the shaft is just spinning within the bearing and not the bearing spinning.

I tried to make sure the grease was off the shaft and not inside the bearing but I'm sure some residual amount was still on it. However at this point I question if it is a concern at all?

Eventually I would assume it would have enough friction after spinning some to wear the grease off, heat up slightly and expand some causing it to become tighter.

Spinning the reel by hand I can't tell 100% sure if the bearing is spinning or the shaft is spinning in the bearing, but to me it's spinning freely with little to no resistance, so it's not like the bearings are frozen or something (all new bearings on both sides).

Should I revisit this? Should I check something else?

https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1CDGOYI_enUS590US590&hl=en-US&ei=RCzGWrz7FI2w_QanyL-YAw&q=john+deere+220c+reel+diagram&oq=john+deere+220c+reel+diagram&gs_l=mobile-gws-serp.3...2271.3625..4207...0....201.1395.0j7j1..........1..mobile-gws-wiz-serp.......0i71j33i160j33i21.5DtpDKe2b9Q%3D#imgrc=WBPgWFAcPRrUTM

 

[g-man]

Eventually I would assume it would have enough friction after spinning some to wear the grease off, heat up slightly and expand some causing it to become tighter.

Heat will cause thermal expansion, both the bearing and shaft will expand, but the bearing will expand more, so it will become looser instead of tighter.

I'm not familiar with the 220c, I will let Pete1313 answer.

 

[kur1j]

Ah yeah, fair enough.

Calling @Pete1313.

I guess I just need to know how to make sure the bearing is on correctly.

 

[Pete1313]

Your good. The tapered bearing cones just slide right on. No press fit. Part #34 retaining clip holds the cone in place on one side, and part #44 compression spring puts preload on everything once it is assembled by putting pressure on spacers #63 and #64. It's the preload pressure that causes the inner part of the bearing(one side with pressure from the clip and the other side with pressure on the spacer) to spin with the reel shaft once assembled. Hope that makes sense. Lmk if you have any other questions. Also check out my rebuild thread if you haven't already.

https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1500

 

[kur1j]

Your good. The tapered bearing cones just slide right on. No press fit. Part #34 retaining clip holds the cone in place on one side, and part #44 compression spring puts preload on everything once it is assembled by putting pressure on spacers #63 and #64. It's the preload pressure that causes the inner part of the bearing(one side with pressure from the clip and the other side with pressure on the spacer) to spin with the reel shaft once assembled. Hope that makes sense. Lmk if you have any other questions. Also check out my rebuild thread if you haven't already.

https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1500

I had not! That is an amazing write up! I'm actuslly using the JD documentation and it is pretty good. Yours is is just as good as theirs or better though. With both options I don't think I'll have a problem. I'm in the process of reassembly at this point. I have the GTC on mine so it's got more gears and crap in the way.

The part I did noticed after looking through your post, and I think I screwed up is the fact that i put a seal on the NON chain side. When I was looking at it last night I saw that the documentation didn't show the inclusion of the seal! It made no sense to me why they left it out and honestly though it was a mistake! Without the sealit I felt it could easily collect tons of debris and to me it was obvious that it was just a mistake! But apparently not!

Would it be bad if I left that seal? Everything seems to fit correctly.

Also you call out the grease from JD. When I was looking around for grease online I ended up with this stuff which is what I used. Luca Oil Xtra Heavy duty grease. Not sure if I just ruined it with that grease or not. But it had similar consistency. It says it's NLGI 2. But not sure if that the same as the "poly" that D recommends.

https://www.google.com/search?q=lucas+xtra+heavy+grease&rlz=1CDGOYI_enUS590US590&hl=en-US&prmd=sivn&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjJlIbBv6PaAhXmdN8KHchsCe4Q_AUIEigC&biw=375&bih=712

 

[g-man]

Are you talking about a seal bearing vs. a non seal one in the gtc? I'm not sure how similar it could be to the 220e. I had a similar question and figured out why they used a non seal one. More info here. https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=1584&start=20

Also, the grease in the reel bearing is very thin and liquid instead of heavy. The 220e uses two different greases. The other is more heavy.

 

[kur1j]

No, I'm talking about in the housing itself for the reel.

If you look at this breakout.

On the gear side it goes seal->bearing cup -> bearing -> seal

On the non gear side it goes seal->bearing cup -> bearing -> spacer->spacer (or if GTC a gear like on mine). There is no back side of the bearing seal on this side.

I ended up ordering 1 seal (the original was mangled to hell when i was getting it out) and the other was okay. I thought it was just missing so I put the seal on both sides even though apparently I wasn't supposed to? Seems really odd to me that they wouldn't include a seal.

As for the grease I used the same #2 grease. I couldn't find anything explicit stating a different type of grease was supposed to be used. Granted this is a 220c so it's a different unit so that could possibly be it? The grease I took out of it has basically the same visccoscity from what I can see.

https://imgur.com/a/ixjPc

 

[Pete1313]

The 220c uses NLGI 2 grease on the reel bearings so you will be good with what you used. The qa5 head on the 220E uses NLGI 0 grease for the reel bearings. From the OM, "If not using any of the preferred greases, be sure to use a general all-purpose grease with an NLGI grade No.2 rating".

There is supposed to be no seal on the outer part of the bearing housing on the GTC side. The gtc and reel bearing on that side share the same grease. With the GTC drive installed and o-ring (part #36 in your first pic) in place, it will keep dust out of the bearing.

 

[kur1j]

@Pete1313

Ugh damnit. Thanks for the reply. I guess that's what I get for not listening to the instructions. Now I have to figure out how to get the stupid out which was the hardest part haha.

I still don't quite see how that seal wouldn't be needed and how it would "share grease". That's a pretty large chamber in the house and stuff to fill up before any grease would come in contact with the gear or any of those components. I dunno just my thought.

 

[Pete1313]

Maybe share grease is the wrong way to say it. You will grease the GTC at the fitting on the GTC and grease the real bearing separately on the fitting on the bearing housing, but excess will go between the two.

Here is the parts diagram of the bearing housing and bearings on a set up without a GTC.

O-ring part-19 fits in a groove on the end of part-3. Then there are the bearings and spacers and compression spring. At the end is part-25 which is a cup that fits over the housing on top of that o-ring and covers everything. It's the cup and o-ring that seals it and keeps the dust/debris out of the bearing and why no outer seal is needed.

You don't have that setup, but can use it to compare. Here is a diagram of the GTC drive.

On yours, part-16 gear replaces part-1 spacer(from the first diagram). You will still have part-19 o-ring on part-3 (from the first diagram). Then part-10, which is a metal bushing/collar, from the GTC assembly will slide over that o-ring and seal the GTC to the bearing housing to keep dust/debris out. Grease from the GTC will be allowed to enter the reel bearing housing and vice versa, but none should leak out and no contaminants would enter.

 

[kur1j]

@Pete1313

Thanks for the detailed response! Yeah I see that from what you are explaining.

I guess it won't matter if the grease is in the housing? I can certainly see that filling up over time just as you put more grease in it. I would assume anyways.

 

[kur1j]

@Pete1313

I got it all back together! The only thing that I think I'm missing is the seal (part 25 on second picture) on the GTC enclosure. I'm 100% positive that it wasn't on it originally when I took it apart. I just think whoever had it before me didn't put it back. I'll order one and put it in it since it will be quick loosening the bolts and then slipping it on.

The only other thing now is the engine not running as smoothly as I would like. It seems to really struggle at low RPM even running and at high RPM it's surging.

I'm debating on just replacing the entire carb. Any suggestions?

 

[J_nick]

It sounds alright to me. A little surging is normal, once there's a load on the engine it should go away.

 

[kur1j]

It sounds alright to me. A little surging is normal, once there's a load on the engine it should go away.

But the bigger problem is it won't hardly even run at < 1/2 throttle. It just kind of dies. If I drop it down to an idle it won't run at all. I would like to run it at 1/2 to 3/4 throttle so I'm not running after the thing.

I was thinking of pulling the carb off of if but for 50$ for a new carb not sure it's worth the time to spend hours taking it apart and trying to clean it.

 

[J_nick]

Clean the main jet. I know I'm my 220B I don't even have to take the carb off to remove it.

Mine was running rough last year after sitting over the winter. I pulled the carb off and gave every hole a shot of carb cleaner and it runs perfect now.

 

[Spammage]

Clean the main jet. I know I'm my 220B I don't even have to take the carb off to remove it.

Mine was running rough last year after sitting over the winter. I pulled the carb off and gave every hole a shot of carb cleaner and it runs perfect now.

+1.

 

[MasterMech]

It sounds alright to me. A little surging is normal, once there's a load on the engine it should go away.

But the bigger problem is it won't hardly even run at < 1/2 throttle. It just kind of dies. If I drop it down to an idle it won't run at all. I would like to run it at 1/2 to 3/4 throttle so I'm not running after the thing.

I was thinking of pulling the carb off of if but for 50$ for a new carb not sure it's worth the time to spend hours taking it apart and trying to clean it.

If it's not idling, yet runs fine under load, it's the pilot jet that needs cleaning most likely. Usually quite easy to pull them out, blow some cleaner through them and button it up. You could also try to feed it a steady diet of fresh gasoline spiked with snake oil. Take your pick of the brand, but sometimes the stuff really does clear up a mild varnishing.

 

[kur1j]

So I worked on this the other day and happy to report it's working quite well now after cleaning out the jets.

https://youtu.be/dfXwvgG-M24