[Eric]

Alright this isn't a renovation thread per say, it's me trying to fix what I messed up!!

A little bit of a back story. I'm going to repeat some for the other thread and I apologize for that. We moved into a new house on May 12th, the yard looked good and I was pretty happy with its condition. The yard is 16 years old and I have no clue what has been done to it over the years so that's all in hindsight.

About a week after moving in 1 put a full application of Milo down, all was good, yard looked good and things were looking up. Towards the middle/end of June I put a bag of forever green fertilizer from Menards down(don't ask me why but I did). After that it got real hot, real dry(drought), and it lasted for quite some time. In fact we are still in a drought but receiving some rain. I wasn't watering as I didn't have to at my last house and the yard stayed ok, but not great.

Middle of July still no rain I started watering the front because it looked bad(real bad), but after a couple weeks nothing showed life. I gave up and decided it was dormant and no amount of water I could put down would help. Two weeks ago the temps let up some and there was some rain forecasted so I put down another app of Milo and watered it in good.

Fast forward to the present, the back yard is showing some signs of life, minus 3 troublesome areas, but the front yard is toast. I've been asking lots of questions here, and I truly appreciate all the insight I've received. I spent the morning at Earl May asking tons of questions as it's time to make a decision and get moving on it. It has been determined that the fert app I applied in June toasted the yard as 1)it didn't get watered in properly, and 2)the high nitrogen toasted and stressed the grass.
Front Yard


Rear Yard



Now for the plan:
Today I overseeded the front yard and troublesome spots in the rear with the following



Starter fertilizer is down, I'm going to water like heck over the next week using hoses, a melnor 4 valve timer, and MP rotator DIY sprinklers. Next week I am going to go over the front yard and 3 spots in the rear with Lawn Restore. And continue to water.

The rest of the yard I'm going to hit strictly using monthly apps of Full Milo pushing nitrogen. Since I screwed up this summer I'm hesitant to use Urea this fall so I'm sticking to Milo. Milo went down today.

I'm new to all of this and I hope some can learn as I go along not only by what I'm doing, but also from my major mistake which now puts me in the situation I am in!

Thanks for reading!!

 

[social port]

rs. Next week I am going to go over the front yard and 3 spots in the rear with Lawn Restore.

Hi Eric,

By lawn restore, do you mean the organic fertilizer?
What was the percentage of nitrogen in your starter fert, and how much did you put down?
I'm asking because I did not expect to read that you plan to put down additional fertilizer in one week after putting starter fertilizer down today/yesterday.

 

[g-man]

Eric,

Seeing the images and your post is kinda telling me that drought was not your real problem. Too much fertilizer was. Mainly the Menards bag in June. Those sections look really gone. If you dropped an inch of water (measure it with tuna cans) and it shows no signs of coming back, then it is gone.

Going forward, start a log. Calculate how much nitrogen you applied per k sqft. Don't exceed 1 of N per rolling month if you could irrigate. If drought, don't use any nitrogen. Here is a post of the log Excel file I use. http://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=921

Like social port pointed out, your current plan shows too much nitrogen. The area that looks bare won't need too much nitrogen until those seeds turn into a young lawn. Water to keep the seed moist (light and frequent) and don't let it get dry.

Now the back, don't over water either since that leads to fungus. Try 0.5inches (measured) every 3-4days until the temperature drop a bit more, then switch to 1in/week. Milo is great, but it won't work all season. It needs active soil microbes and those go to sleep as temperature drop. You will need to switch for a synthetic fertilizer. Don't worry, as long as you keep a log and don't go over the 1lb of N/k you should be fine.

 

[Eric]

The starter fertilizer was 15-23-10, for a 17 lb bag I put 10lbs down over 4000 sq ft. Which if my math serves me correctly that's 2.5lbs/k and .375# N. earl May suggested using the restore next week, as long as I watered regularly. But I can wait 4 weeks as well, I was kind of thinking that tonight. Ringer is 10-0-6, and a full app would add another .5# of N.

I have set up a Melnor timer watering the 2 zones in the front for 10min every 4 hours, the back I have set for 10min every 8hrs as there is more established grass around these areas and I was thinking about the fungus issues. After tomorrow I was going to turn the front down to every 6, just wanted to get the starter fert and seeds embedded well.

I totally agree I dropped too much fert, not sure what I was thinking, wished I'd have found you all much sooner and I wouldn't have made such a dumb mistake.

I was going to do the ringer next week, again I don't have to, more than willing to wait, and then around 9/20, drop a full rate of Milo on the yard, was going to do the same around 10/20, and then use some sort of synthetic in November for the last run(looking for advice here as to a fast release N source besides Urea). Is it safe to use Milo in October or should that be a synthetic as well.

Moving forward I will be documenting what the heck I'm doing, my thought process was obviously scewd and it's never burnt me in the past so I guess I didn't know any better. I know now, pretty much after June 1st I'm done with fert until the temps drop in August.

 

[Eric]

Eric,

Seeing the images and your post is kinda telling me that drought was not your real problem. Too much fertilizer was. Mainly the Menards bag in June. Those sections look really gone. If you dropped an inch of water (measure it with tuna cans) and it shows no signs of coming back, then it is gone.

Going forward, start a log. Calculate how much nitrogen you applied per k sqft. Don't exceed 1 of N per rolling month if you could irrigate. If drought, don't use any nitrogen. Here is a post of the log Excel file I use. http://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=921

Like social port pointed out, your current plan shows too much nitrogen. The area that looks bare won't need too much nitrogen until those seeds turn into a young lawn. Water to keep the seed moist (light and frequent) and don't let it get dry.

Now the back, don't over water either since that leads to fungus. Try 0.5inches (measured) every 3-4days until the temperature drop a bit more, then switch to 1in/week. Milo is great, but it won't work all season. It needs active soil microbes and those go to sleep as temperature drop. You will need to switch for a synthetic fertilizer. Don't worry, as long as you keep a log and don't go over the 1lb of N/k you should be fine.

That sheet is a great reference! Thank you!! Couple questions it appears you use Milo and cracked corn? I need to read up on that, it appears your Milo rate is around 6#K and your cracked corn is around 9#K, is that correct? See I have lots to learn. It also appears you go heavy during the month of May, give a small feeding .5K around the fourth then hold off til August, is that a fair assumption as well?

I've also been mowing around 2.25" the last 4 weeks(well the grass that's actually growing,lol) should I keep that height or go up a notch to around 2.75", currently mowing every 3 days trying to stimulate growth.

 

[social port]

The starter fertilizer was 15-23-10, for a 17 lb bag I put 10lbs down over 4000 sq ft. Which if my math serves me correctly that's 2.5lbs/k and .375# N. earl May suggested using the restore next week, as long as I watered regularly. But I can wait 4 weeks as well, I was kind of thinking that tonight. Ringer is 10-0-6, and a full app would add another .5# of N.

OK, that makes sense. You're going with lower doses per application.
That sounds about right to me, but you should wait for someone else to chime in. The extra N from earlier in the year may change what is currently needed--just being cautious.

 

[Eric]

How long does N last in the soil, meaning the earlier apps. Restless night busy thinking has me at the thought. In 4 weeks add Restore over the whole yard which would eqaul .313#N with it add an additional .5#N of Milo. This isn't a full #, but basically over the next month through watering and hopefully some rain, it will help leach out some of the old N from the summer. Actually got a nice steady .5" rain last night with more to come today/night!

 

[g-man]

The starter fertilizer was 15-23-10, for a 17 lb bag I put 10lbs down over 4000 sq ft. Which if my math serves me correctly that's 2.5lbs/k and .375# N. earl May suggested using the restore next week, as long as I watered regularly. But I can wait 4 weeks as well, I was kind of thinking that tonight. Ringer is 10-0-6, and a full app would add another .5# of N.

I have set up a Melnor timer watering the 2 zones in the front for 10min every 4 hours, the back I have set for 10min every 8hrs as there is more established grass around these areas and I was thinking about the fungus issues. After tomorrow I was going to turn the front down to every 6, just wanted to get the starter fert and seeds embedded well.

I totally agree I dropped too much fert, not sure what I was thinking, wished I'd have found you all much sooner and I wouldn't have made such a dumb mistake.

I was going to do the ringer next week, again I don't have to, more than willing to wait, and then around 9/20, drop a full rate of Milo on the yard, was going to do the same around 10/20, and then use some sort of synthetic in November for the last run(looking for advice here as to a fast release N source besides Urea). Is it safe to use Milo in October or should that be a synthetic as well.

Moving forward I will be documenting what the heck I'm doing, my thought process was obviously scewd and it's never burnt me in the past so I guess I didn't know any better. I know now, pretty much after June 1st I'm done with fert until the temps drop in August.

Are you working a night shift? it looks like you stayed up all night.

15-23-10 is 15% Nitrogen by weight, 23% phosphorus by weight and 10% potassium. If you applied 10lb of the product, you then applied 1.5lb of N, 2.3lb of p and 1.0lb of potassium. Since you spread the product over 4k, then your rate is .375lb of N/k, 0.575lb P/k and 0.25lb of K//k. In the log file I sent, if you type the NPK value and weight of applied product it will calculate all of this. If you select multiple rows in the n/K column, it will give you the total for those rows (easy way to get monthly total).

10min every 4hrs means that at 11pm and 2am it is watering the lawn or are you turning off after 6pm? Night watering is not recommended since it promotes fungus.

That sheet is a great reference! Thank you!! Couple questions it appears you use Milo and cracked corn? I need to read up on that, it appears your Milo rate is around 6#K and your cracked corn is around 9#K, is that correct? See I have lots to learn. It also appears you go heavy during the month of May, give a small feeding .5K around the fourth then hold off til August, is that a fair assumption as well?

I've also been mowing around 2.25" the last 4 weeks(well the grass that's actually growing,lol) should I keep that height or go up a notch to around 2.75", currently mowing every 3 days trying to stimulate growth.

The sheet is an example. I added different things to show examples. Don't read too much into it or use it as a guide. Weighting stuff takes time, so I avoid it if possible in the low risk stuff. I drop Milo by the bag (36lb) or the bag of corn (50lb) so i don't have to weight it or have partial bags of stuff.

 

[Eric]

I will be shutting it off at night, think I'm going to adjust the times for all areas to run at 7, 1 and then 7. It allows me to wake my *** up turn it on and then shut it off before I go to bed, lol, yes I did sleep last night, just may not appear that way. I'm hell bent on fixing this mess I created!!!

Correction probably 8, noon, and 4. This will give it time to dry out before night falls

 

[social port]

How long does N last in the soil, meaning the earlier apps.

I'm not sure. Most labs don't report values for nitrogen, presumably because nitrogen can vary so widely during even a short period of time. I don't think nitrogen values are all that helpful for that reason. It seems like we all plan for nitrogen apps based on more general knowledge pertaining to what is required for a given grass type in a given region.

Your plan, as I understand it, will give you slightly under one pound of N in a month. You should be fine. I was just putting out the qualification that a special recommendation might be needed in your case because of the very heavy app earlier this year. I didn't want to make a suggestion that might possibly stand in the way of your...redemption.

 

[Eric]

Well crap!!! The day after I decide to overseed we get over an inch of rain with what appears to be more coming! Let hope the seed embedded itself in what grass particles were left and didnt all wash away. The upside I guess is I got it down early so I can add more next week if it doesn't appear I'm getting any germination!! Haven't had rain like this in probably over 3 months, so I am grateful for that at least. We will now be able to see if any of the trouble spots have any life left!!

 

[Eric]

Can someone help me verify that this is indeed bluegrass?

 

[Eric]

Well pretty sure this is the culprit that I jacked my yard with! Looking at labels tonight I realized that it's 22% fast release Urea/ 6% slow release. Would be good for the fall blitz, not so good to drop on 6/26 with massive heat and heading into a drought! For anyone looking for a realatively cheap Urea source this may be the ticket. $12 for a 32 lb bag drops 1.12#N on my 8k

 

[Eric]

Ok looking towards fall and developing a plan! On 8/20 I put .375#N on the overseeded areas and .72#N on the rest of the yard. I have devised a rough schedule to move throughout the fall, looking for insight if it is too much N for the overseeded areas, too little N for the rest, or a good compromise to help nurse the yard back. This is all based on 8k of yard.

9/3- 1 Bag Restore and 1 bag Milo=.54#
9/17- 2 Bags Milo= .45#
10/1- 2 Bags Milo=.45#
10/15-2 Bags Milo=.45#

Now the last app may not happen I have a 50% chance of frost by 10/3 and 90% by 10/16. At which point I'll stop fert, mow until grass stops growing and then before the ground feeezes I'll probably use the above culprit as my Urea source as I now realize it's Urea.

So let me hear it is the too much for the new guys or not, aggressive enough for the others?

 

[Roosterchest]

Can someone help me verify that this is indeed bluegrass?

Looks like PRG.

 

[Eric]

I'm gonna take it in Saturday for ID, the blades are v shaped with a pointy tip, which leads me to believe it's still KBG, i just wonder if it looks like perennial Rye because it's so thinned out right now!

 

[social port]

So let me hear it is the too much for the new guys or not, aggressive enough for the others?

I think this rule is your best guide.

Don't exceed 1 of N per rolling month if you could irrigate

 

[Eric]

So let me hear it is the too much for the new guys or not, aggressive enough for the others?

I think this rule is your best guide.

Don't exceed 1 of N per rolling month if you could irrigate

Yeah I'm basically making sure I don't break that rule, if anything I'm going a bit under!! Just didn't know if it is less stress to go every 2 weeks instead of once every 4? Some articles say you can push harder at a # every 2, bit since is stressed from the summer though I would go a pound per month and kinda spoon feed it, even though most articles I've read say spoon feeding is weekly.

 

[Eric]

So it turns out my yard is actually some sort of fescue blend and not KBG, I'm feeling super smart right now! I've already overseeded with a KBG PRG blend and now I'm gonna need to decide what to do. Options are just ignore the fact and keep fertilizing and watering, spread more of the blend over the rest of the yard, or go buy a straight fescue mix and spread that over the whole yard! Really leaning towards option 1, the damage is already done, I guess I need to see how everything bounces back and fills in

 

[g-man]

It is called a Northern mix. With proper fertilization and care it will look awesome. Go to pete1313 reno thread and look at the before roundup picture. Use this lawn to learn how to take it to the next level and then maybe do a reno in a few years.