[sam]

Hi All

This year dutch / white clover is going completely wild in my lawn, and I'm curious what's happening, and how do I get the grass to compete.

I've been giving nitrogen over the last year so it's not quite that simple

To be clear: we're not talking bits and patches of clover mixed in with the grass - no this looks like clover on steroids consuming everything. Low-maintenance lawns in my neighborhood have normal patches of clover here and there, but what I have happening is something completely different.

I don't want to use herbicides and I'm happy with a "mixed greens" look, but I just don't want to end up with very little grass in the mix and that seems to be the direction its headed.

My questions are: What do you think is happening and what can I do to get the grass to complete? (no herbicides) Everything I read says give it nitrogen, but I give nitrogen and despite that I have way more clover than lawns that don't give nitrogen.

The only thing I can think of is as follows. Would phosphorus drive clover? Because In early spring (late March) I fertilized with a mix of more phosphorus than N because my soil test indicated P was extremely low (soil test below, again all within legal limits). Would that P have driven the clover at the expense of grass?
* Prior to that spring app of P, my last N apps were back in September and October of last year though it was organic so should have lasted a little while (ringer safer brand)
* Then there was the P app in late March (there was some N in the mix too, but not as much as P)
* Then I followed up in late April with a medium dose of organic N (ringer safer brand again)

 

[g-man]

Clover started last year. Did you maintained your lawn irrigated last year above your neighbors?

I spotted some clover in my yard and I normally don't have it. I mixed 1/2gallon tank of triclopyr with nis and AS.

 

[sam]

Clover started last year. Did you maintained your lawn irrigated last year above your neighbors?

I spotted some clover in my yard and I normally don't have it. I mixed 1/2gallon tank of triclopyr with nis and AS.

Yes I always had some clover last year and prior years, and I'm cool with that, the issue is that it's going completely crazy this year like it's on steroids and taking over

No I don't irrigate much. Just a bit if I need to water in an app or new seeding

 

[Jconnelly6b]

Can you take some pictures?

 

[Delmarva Keith]

I've observed similar situations in the past. Always puzzles me what's going on but I've come to conclude that sometimes it's just an indication that soil fertility is finally right and whatever weeds are there start competing super vigorously. Sometimes grasses just lose that competition. Law of the turf jungle. If you don't want to use any herbicides, it will be very tough to get rid of. Aggressive dethatching (tear the crap out of it) and overseeding (with fert per recent soil test - i.e. enough but not too much P) every fall may help.

Where do you get your soil tested? Format looks very familiar to me. U Del and U MD must use the same software.

 

[ForsheeMS]

Clover loves a pH of 6.5 to 7.0 and thrives where there is plenty of P & K. It also pulls nitrogen out of the air and fixes it in the root system where your grass can use it and really won't benefit from nitrogen applications. From the test you K was already good and now you've thrown the P to it as well making the conditions ideal for clover. As others have said, herbicides are about the only way to get rid of it. Triclopyr works great but may take 2 treatments. You can also expect it to pop back up from the seeds that have been dropped.

 

[Richard Slater]

Given you seem to have hit the sweet spot from a nutrient perspective you probably only have two options:

• Weaken the clover using cultural practices - I.e pull it out, mow at a level that your grass will thrive at but the clover will stuggle
• strengthen the grass selectively, perhaps by spraying everything except the clover with RGS/Humic Acid so that it has a better chance of out competing the clover.

Clover makes it's own N so I doubt adding N will cause significant extra growth, so it might just be simpler to #EnjoyTheMow and then work on strengthening the turfgrass in the fall and take advantage of the clover being in it's off season.

 

[j4c11]

I've seen very thick sections of grass get taken over by clover in a matter of weeks. I think what happens is the clover shades the grass underneath and the grass is unable to recover. It spreads fast too. A dose of broadleaf herbicide would thin it out where the grass would get a shot at competing, but not eliminate it. But if you're ideologically opposed to herbicide, then hand pulling is an option for sure.

 

[probasestealer]

I don't mind a little Dutch white clover, a lot I write consider spot spraying

 

[Suburban Jungle Life]

Where do you get your soil tested? Format looks very familiar to me. U Del and U MD must use the same software.

UMD doesn't do soil testing for some reason even though they have an ag dept and do ntep trials. They say to use UD or some other place and then use UMD recommendations for fert. :roll:

 

[Suburban Jungle Life]

If you don't want to use herbicides, then you will definitely have an uphill battle! You can try to mow tall so the clover doesn't shade the grass as much. Mow at 4-5". Also, since clover makes it's own nitrogen, give the grass plenty of nitrogen on a routine schedule so the grass has as much as it needs to thrive and compete with the clover. Of course, all the plants including weeds will enjoy the fertilizer. But, combining good nutrition along with with a cut closer to 5" should help the grass some. In the fall, overseed and fertilize to get the grass as thick as you can.

 

[sam]

Thanks all for your comments.

Below are some belated photos. I also added them to the first post

 

[g-man]

Sam, that's a lot. I don't see any other way than using triclopyr. I would add Ammonium sulfate to speed up the kill. I understand that you don't want to use chemicals, but I just don't see any other way.

 

[Jconnelly6b]

Sam, that's a lot. I don't see any other way than using triclopyr. I would add Ammonium sulfate to speed up the kill. I understand that you don't want to use chemicals, but I just don't see any other way.

+1

 

[Suburban Jungle Life]

Sam, that's a lot. I don't see any other way than using triclopyr. I would add Ammonium sulfate to speed up the kill. I understand that you don't want to use chemicals, but I just don't see any other way.

+2

 

[Austin]

Wow, that is a lot of clover! I would spray it as well.

 

[g-man]

There is one option without chemicals. Sod cutter and get new sod or seeds.

 

[sam]

Ok thanks guys. I said it was crazy didn't I? :lol:

What if this fall at over seeding I was really agressive eg with scalping it down metal raking, etc. any chance the grass would make headway?

On a similar note, is it just as active in the fall or does grass get a bit of advantage then?

 

[Delmarva Keith]

Ok thanks guys. I said it was crazy didn't I? :lol:

What if this fall at over seeding I was really agressive eg with scalping it down metal raking, etc. any chance the grass would make headway?

On a similar note, is it just as active in the fall or does grass get a bit of advantage then?

I've never dealt with an infestation that extensive but for more "usual" sized patches, tearing the crap out of them (I've used a tractor mounted detatch rake with weights on it) and seeding in Fall with heavy fertilization does knock it back significantly. It could take years to get rid of most of it and I don't think you'll ever get rid of all of it. If you're completely against chemicals, you don't have much to lose by trying.

Triclopyr will get rid of it in a couple / few weeks

 

[probasestealer]

Have you considered a dutch white clover monostand? If you stay on top of morning it could work...
But yeah, no chemicals (which I understand) you're in trouble. How about tenacity? It's at least a reduced risk herbicide