[Alex1389]

Going to give this a shot. I've kept a partial journal on Evernote throughout the season, but I've missed a few things so I'm working from memory on some of these items:

4/1/2018 -- Ringer Lawn Restore .75 #/k N (Really regret doing this)
4/10/2018 -- Lesco Starter Fert .75 #/k N. Fast Acting Lime.
Sometime between these dates -- Landscapers applied Dimension 0-0-7
4/29/2018 -- RGS/Air8/Greene Effect Cocktail
5/18/2018 -- .5 #/K Milorganite. Fast Acting Lime. Spectracide insecticide.
6/9/2018 -- Scotts Starter Fert w/ Mesotrione on backyard. .75 #/K N
6/14/2018 -- Landscapers applied 19-0-0 Lesco + Dimension to front and side yards
7/2/2018 -- .5 N/K Milorganite. Curative rate Disease Ex back yard/Preventative Rate side/front yards. 3 #/K Ironite. 6 #/K Fast Acting Lime Back and Side Yards. 12 #/K Fast Acting Lime front yard.
8/17/2018 -- 1 #/M SOP
8/21/2018 -- 4oz rate Tenacity blanket spray; 2 oz/M Propiconazole
8/23/18 -- .5 N/M 46-0-0
8/26/18 -- Prodiamine at .4 oz/M

2019

4/6/19 -- .25lb ai/ac of Dimension
4/10/19 -- .80lb N/M 18-24-12 Starter Fert
4/30/19 - 1 oz/K PPZ, 1 oz/K Feature, .5 oz/K T-Nex
5/11/19 - .5 N/M Carbon-X

Problem Areas:

Backyard -- The backyard actually appears to be the best part of my property; however, it has zoysia mixed in there so it needs a reno. I'm not sure how the zoysia got in there, as I purchased the place two years ago and it's always been a problem. Zoysia looks great in the summer, but I'm not fond of the early fall dormancy and late spring green-up. I hit the backyard with Mesotrione instead of Dimension in hopes that the Dimension wouldn't be there to hinder my reno efforts.

Street Parkway -- I've included some pictures below of a grass I'm dealing with there. Would appreciate any help in identifying the grass. The grass seems to have spread underneath the sidewalk to the other side as well. Tenacity lit this grass up when I sprayed in the spring, but it didn't kill it off. To be fair, I only sprayed it once because it was such a large area that was highlighted, and I didn't want to try to oversee with the summer temps looming.

General Area -- I seem to have many areas throughout the lawn that have a very fine, thick grass that has matted down in some spots and just dried out in others. I think it's a fine fescue, but I'll post a pic for some confirmation. These areas were all great in the spring, but the summer heat is really exposing them now.

I'm 99% certain that I'll completely renovate the backyard this August. I have the Round-Up on hand and planned on starting the kill on 7/6/18 with a seed down date of 8/4/18. I'm a little torn on the mix of seed I'll use, but I'm thinking a KBG/PRG or KBG/TTTF 80/20 mix. I've followed a few threads on renos here in Jersey with the TTTF blend and they turned out awesome! I'd appreciate any input here on the seed choice and seed source . . .

Ultimately, my goal is to have KBG be the dominant grass throughout the yard. I'm trying my luck here with the backyard reno and then will consider a front/side yard reno next year.

Some additional info:

I've had Soil Savvy tests done, but I haven't had a chance to have another lab that's recommended here perform an analysis. I'm also irrigated so I do plan on applying Milo (likely on 7/4). Pictures below:

Front Yard 5/23/18:



Side Yard 5/23/18:



Backyard 5/23/18:



Backyard 6/18/18:

 

[Alex1389]

Parkway Problem Grass:

 

[Alex1389]

Some more pics that I snapped today after a fresh morning mow.

Front yard 6/18/18:



Backyard 6/18/18:



Side yard 6/18/18:



You can see some of the heat stress on that front lawn. I have several patches of what appears to be fine fescue in there that are drying out.

I also began using Round-Up around the stone retaining walls to add some beds to the property. Just too annoying to try to weed whack the lawn around those stones . . .

 

[g-man]

Alex, welcome. I saw your post about the problem area but I did not have time to reply. It looks like quackgrass. We will need more pictures in focus of the auricle. If it is, round up is the most effective way around it.

 

[Alex1389]

Hey @g-man, thanks for offering to help! I've attached a few close up pics. Let me know if these work. Thanks!

 

[g-man]

I don't see clasping auricles and I see a large ligule, so it might be orchardgrass.

 

[Alex1389]

@g-man Yeah I had my doubts about quackgrass, but Orchardgrass might be on the money. Tenacity did bleach it early in the spring, but I never followed up with a second application. I'll try Tenacity again soon.

 

[g-man]

Hmm, i think you should carefully paint it with round up. I don't think tenacity will kill it.

 

[Alex1389]

Hmm, i think you should carefully paint it with round up. I don't think tenacity will kill it.

Thanks again, @g-man. I guess I could use this as an excuse to do a mini-renovation on the parkway this fall

I'm also finding a few areas around my lawn that just seem to brown off a bit more easily than other areas. I've attached a few photos. My initial thoughts were that these are just creeping fescue patches. They seem to mat down instead of being sucked up into the mower as well, so these patches make for an overall bad look. Any idea what the below could be?

 

[g-man]

It does look like a fine fescue. In my opinion, fine fescue should not be in full sun areas.

 

[Alex1389]

@g-man, thanks again for your continued help! Really appreciate you taking the time here!

I bought the house in 2016 and was swamped with remodeling the interior that I didn't really start caring about the lawn until late last year. I'm sure the previous owners used sun & shade mixes during overseeding. I'm not sure how the fine fescues were able to compete so well against the PRG and KBG in those full sun areas, but it's something I have to deal with unfortunately. I've overseeded only with PRG for the past two years.

Any chance of getting the KBG to spread and choke out the fescue over the next several years, or is a reno on the front yard my only option here?

 

[Alex1389]

Finally got around to having a soil test done. Here are the results.

Guess I need a bit of advice from you guys here on whether I'm good to go with a renovation based on these results, or if I should wait another year and work on the soil deficiencies. I need to start nuking the zoysia ASAP if I'm going to reno in August...

The area I would renovate is the "back lawn" on the reports.

 

[g-man]

I saw that the guys already addressed your soil results. You have a good soil and nothing there prevents from having a great lawn. :thumbup:

 

[Alex1389]

I saw that the guys already addressed your soil results. You have a good soil and nothing there prevents from having a great lawn. :thumbup:

Yep! All good, @g-man. Thanks for your help!

Now I just need to make a decision on whether or not I move forward with this reno :thumbup:

 

[Alex1389]

Need some advice here. I need to put down prodiamine, Tenacity, and maybe some propiconazole. Propiconazole I would spray pretty soon to help with lingering fungus pressure. Am I able to tank mix that with Tenacity?

I'm thinking of blanket spraying tenacity in order to kill off some fine fescue in the sunny areas. Saw a thread where @ken-n-nancy was planning on doing the same. Problem is I have some PRG in the same areas and it looks like FF and PRG are both limited to the 5oz per acre rate. If I use that rate, do you guys think any FF will be killed off? I do want to blanket spray for weed control as well, so it wouldn't be a complete waste of time. But the ultimate goal is to kill off some FF as well. Think I can get away with going slightly higher on the rate with minimal impact to the PRG?

Lastly, should I apply prodiamine after I've applied Tenacity or should I just hold off on that since Tenacity will give me some pre-m protection?

 

[Alex1389]

So I think I screwed up my Prodiamine application. I applied at the .4 oz/M rate for 5-months of coverage through the winter and into early next spring. However, it looks like that puts me dangerously close to the annual limit of .55 oz/M for my NoMix (yes, FF is lower rate but I could care less about my FF).

For those of you using Prodiamine, how do you get your 12-month coverage against the annual limits? Unless I'm missing something, it doesn't seem possible with the rates they've listed on the label vs the # of months of protection.

 

[Mozart]

Any chance of getting the KBG to spread and choke out the fescue over the next several years, or is a reno on the front yard my only option here?

I'm not sure if this is a valid strategy but I am also looking to thin out fine fescue and let KBG take over as much as possible without a full renovation.

I plan to blanket spray the fine fescue area with tenacity, not sure what rate yet but possibly at the 6oz/acre rate. If I understand correctly this rate is within the tolerance limit for KBG but well above the maximum per year application for fine fescue.

Once the FF turns white I plan to basically "dethatch" the FF out and hope that resulting bare soil areas would fill in naturally with KBG. @g-man, what do you think? Would that work? (Manipulating environment/culture to favor KBG over FF)

 

[Alex1389]

Any chance of getting the KBG to spread and choke out the fescue over the next several years, or is a reno on the front yard my only option here?

I'm not sure if this is a valid strategy but I am also looking to thin out fine fescue and let KBG take over as much as possible without a full renovation.

I plan to blanket spray the fine fescue area with tenacity, not sure what rate yet but possibly at the 6oz/acre rate. If I understand correctly this rate is within the tolerance limit for KBG but well above the maximum per year application for fine fescue.

Once the FF turns white I plan to basically "dethatch" the FF out and hope that resulting bare soil areas would fill in naturally with KBG. @g-man, what do you think? Would that work? (Manipulating environment/culture to favor KBG over FF)

When I blanket sprayed Tenacity last week, I double lapped the area last that were thick FF. It bleached them for sure and some of those areas look to be smoked. I think the Tenacity strategy might actually work.

 

[g-man]

So I think I screwed up my Prodiamine application. I applied at the .4 oz/M rate for 5-months of coverage through the winter and into early next spring. However, it looks like that puts me dangerously close to the annual limit of .55 oz/M for my NoMix (yes, FF is lower rate but I could care less about my FF).

For those of you using Prodiamine, how do you get your 12-month coverage against the annual limits? Unless I'm missing something, it doesn't seem possible with the rates they've listed on the label vs the # of months of protection.

I dont need 12 months coverage since we get snow from December to February.

Option 1:
Spring application at 1lb /acre = 0.65lb ai/acre= .36oz/M. This yields 5 months of control (March - July)
Early fall at 0.5lb / acre = 0.32lb ai/acre = 0.185oz/M This is 3 months of control (August, Sept, Oct)
Total = 1.5lb/acre = 0.97lb ai/acre = 0.54oz / M

Option 2:
3 applications at 0.5lb / acre = 0.32lb ai/acre = 0.185oz/M each. In March, mid May, mid August

Option 3 (my preferrence):
Spring application at 0.5lb / acre = 0.32lb ai/acre = 0.185oz/M (March- May)
Supplement with dithopyor in May (for crabgrass control)
Early fall at 1lb /acre = 0.65lb ai/acre= .36oz/M This is 5 months of control (August - Dec)

There are other approaches (ie. use tenacity in august for overseed and then do 0.5lb/acre ). It will depend on how much crabgrass or poa a problems you had in the past. I could kill crabgrass a lot easier than poa a. Once your weeds are under control for a year, then the rates could be reduced since there are less seeds available.

 

[Alex1389]

@g-man Thanks for the different options -- very helpful!

I noticed you listed ai/acre in your reply. I applied .4 ounces of product/M, which I think would come out to .26 ai/M. The product label does state to only apply .55 oz of product/M. I imagine I should discard the ai/M calculation here?

Given my blunder, I think it's best that I pick up in April with Dithiopyr at this point instead of Prodiamine. I do want to Reno eventually, so hopefully a Dithiopyr application in April gets me through to June/July before I start rounding up. If I don't Reno, I can apply a second Dithiopyr application in June.

My desire for 12-months of pre-m control stems from my understanding that poa annua can germinate in late winter/early spring if the soil temperatures are right. Does that sound accurate or am I overthinking this? Maybe I'm overthinking this and could just deal with the few stragglers of poa that germinate during the right temps in winter...